Newspaper :  “Version” July 5-7

Title: interview with Dimitri Shashkini

Nino Lursmanashvili

Around 2,200 public schools, 200 private schools, 70 accredited universities, up to 200 licensed universities, 42 vocational education and training centers, 63 research institutions, more than 600 school children and their parents, 75,000 teachers. . . this is one part of the system that is managed by Dimitri Shashkini. Sometimes numbers better express ideas. It is difficult to make decisions that satisfy all these people.  But talent is needed to attract attention and provoke so many accusations around you as it happened with Dimitri Shashkini. Minister of Education nearly exceeds Minister of Internal Affairs in this issue. Maybe the reason is the beginning of the second wave of the educational reform. In general, innovations are not met with pleasure in Georgia. Maybe the reason is the beginning of Unified Entry Exams and educational system is more actual than politics. My interest attracted so many articles in newspapers and colloquies. So I decided to meet Dimitri Shashkini in order to ask him what he is going to do with the future generation; they will go to schools from the age of 5. Why is he interfering in the activities of professional unions?  Did he really request to put of icons from the walls  of class rooms? During half and an hour, Minister answered all questions. Only one topic was avoided and I found the answer in the near room – the Minister has the corner of icons. A small table stands there with candles and books of prayers. I will not continue this topic any more. The readers will understand the reason I mentioned this topic and the fact.

I offer interview with the Minister of Education and Science, Dimitri Shashkini.

Mr.Minister, this is our first interview. So I want to ask how did you join the educational system after MCLA?

Unfortunately this is the first interview. Theoretically there shouldn’t be problems in the relations with the journalists. My goal is to be the manager of one of the most transparent Ministries. I cannot carry out any reform without public knowledge. And we inform the society with the contribution of journalists. Educational sphere is quite difficult and large. There is no family in Georgia that is not concerned with education.

That is the reason several appointed Ministers could not solve the problems and they began their office from the beginning? It means the main problem is in the system.

I can’t agree. I have a feeling many things were made. But a lot have to be done. The President announced beginning of the second wave of educational reform. The main goal is achieved – the entrants are enrolled in higher educational institutions without corruption. Entrants know that they will be admitted in the universities according to their knowledge. This is the great success. This fundament gives us opportunity to give American and European quality education to our students. But I do not say that mistakes were not made.  People who do not do anything do not make mistakes.

You noted Unified Entry Exams. This year entrants will have to pass four exams. Is the fewer amount of entrants provoked for these four exams?

Yes, for the first time this year, entrants will have to pass four exams. The state grant will be allocated according to the results of all four exams and not only with general abilities. This is the fair system and this is the main for me. Graduates who studied at schools in Armenian and Azerbaijanian languages will have opportunity to pass general ability tests in native language. Afterwards, they will study Georgian language program during one year and then continue studying. This year teachers’ certification and MA exams are being held as well. . .The amount of entrants is not little. The amount is increased in 7,000. There is the healthy competition among higher educational institutions. This brought good results.

Decision was made that higher educational institutions will not be taxed. But creating funds is initiated. What are you planning about these funds?

That is right that higher educational institutions will not be taxed. I want to thank Mr. Kakha Baindurashvili for considering our opinions. Higher educational institutions exist that have the annual income of 6-8 mln. But the conception of sustainability does not exist in many institutions and the state is responsible for caring. It is good that the state gives privileges to the higher educational institutions. But they should think of institutional development on their own as well. Bankrupting higher educational institutions will damage many families. Therefore, creating the system that will give the higher educational institutions not to be depended only on state is very important. So we offered the “Endowment Foundation” that successfully works in Europe and America.

Can you explain, what does “Endowment Foundations” mean?

Income of higher educational institution will be stored in bank and the university will use the percent of this amount. This is designed to solve different problems as well as receive salaries and prizes. When the base exists, higher educational institution will endure risks and the danger of bankruptcy almost does not exist.

Did the heads of higher educational institutions like this initiative?

Yes, they did. They positively met the idea. The group is created that will develop the draft law in around 10 days. If the government likes it, we will send it to the parliament. This innovation will support the development of universities.

As I know, innovations are introduced in national curriculum as well. . .

Yes, you are right. When I was appointed as the Minister of Education, I underlined my priorities – teacher and the school children. My task is to reduce additional uncertain barriers. School children have to think about studying and the teachers about teaching. Therefore, assessment system will be changed in the new national curriculum that was very difficult before the present. Teachers should not spend time in calculating the percents. Considering teachers arguments, we made a decision to introduce three component evaluation system – homework, work in the class room and tests. All of them will equal value. This will be much more transparent system for the school children and easier for the teachers. Before the present component existed for example – activity in the classroom. But some children are calm and really they might know more than active children. The feeling of unfairness can provoke traumas. Besides, dates of holidays will be exactly defined. This factor is important for the parents who want to take day offs and have a rest together with their children. School will begin on September 15 and finish on June 15 (first and 11^th graders will finish studying in May 24-25). Large holidays will begin on December 24 until January 20. And Easer holidays will be also operating – it will begin on Big Thursday and finish on Wednesday of the next week. The innovation is introducing semesters instead of trimesters by the request of the teachers. Journals will be also changed. This will become the document of strict registration. Fine sanctions will be introduced for falsification of this document. Besides, we have to remember protection of the school children’s rights that is one more innovation.

How are you going to protect children’s rights?

I will sign an order in the nearest future and the mechanism of appeal will be introduced. If eh child thinks that his mark is unfair, he/she will be able to prove his/her knowledge in the presence of the commission. The commission will be created by the school principal. One member will be from MES or resource center. Incorrect practice of criticizing one child and praising another at parents meetings will be abolished. By the new rule, the teacher will be responsible for individual relations with the parents.

We are introducing tutors hours – one day a week tutor will give classes in humane, patriotic issues. This is especially important in primary classes. Order will be returned at schools. The school will try to involve parent in children bringing up. If the parent avoids this responsibility, administrational sanction and fine sanctions will be launched. This article existed in administrational code before nut it did not work until the present.

It is interesting how are you going to define that parents are avoiding their duties?

If the school principal invites the parent for several times and asks to explain the child rules of behavior but the parent does not react, he/she will have to pay a fine. First time – 100 Gel, the second – 200 gel. If the school child violates inter order, he school principal has the right to use sanctions against this child as well. Many so called experts live in Georgia who are far from educational sphere and they live in virtual world. They expressed claims that we are creating Mercedes using the parts of Zhiguli. This is false. Safe school problem is the global problem. Resource officers successful, institute is approved by statistics – crime is significantly decreased at schools. Besides, school child get used to the order and integration in society will be easy for them.

Mr. Minister, I talk about different problems. Resource officer may be the boy of 20 years old without higher education. Many problems may be provoked by relations of 15-16 age girls and 20 years boys.

This is conspiracy theory. Everything has counterarguments. Numbers express the reality – only around 30 candidates of 700 willing candidates crossed the level. They pass very difficult competition of three rounds. They pass psychological tests as well. Believe, we fully realize our responsibility and we try not to do mistakes. Necessity of entering resource officers is approved by much gratitude of parents and above mentioned statistics.

Some people say that lawyer Shashkini resembled schools prisons.

I worked for many years in an American corporation before MCLA. There are 75,000 teachers in Georgia. Making decision that will be acceptable for everyone is impossible. Some might be of different profession trying to oppress others. Sometimes teachers use their profession unkindly. Simple example is when teacher sent the school child to buy funeral flowers. This is violation of children’s rights.

Is this the reason you ordered the school principals to dismiss teachers?

Do you believe in it?

School principals say they received such order. Some teachers are already dismissed. . .

Ministry did not interfere in the staff approval for two years. This provoked great chaos. We discovered 105 artificial jobs at schools. One official was registered for each post. I twice asked the principals to present the table of organization. I said that scene-painters and 8 deputies will not be approved. I also said to distribute working hours fairly. It will be interesting for your readers that the full working hours of the teachers is 18 hours. Teachers are no t paid for additional hours. So I said to the principals give the 12 hour teachers additional hours from 23 hour teachers. 99% of school principals adequately responded on this announcement. But some gave to all 18 hours and dismissed other teachers. These principals are already dismissed.

The school is LEPL and it independently decides teachers’ employment or dismissal. Minister does not interfere in this issue. I did not give any order or instructions. But some principals dismissed teachers for personal reasons and they say that MES ordered so. I address to all teachers and principals to call the hot line of General Inspection of MES if they are dismissed on behalf of MES, because MES did not give such order.

Principals dismissed nurses as well as the teachers. Do you believe that resource officers will be able to fulfill doctor’s functions?

Thank you for this question. When I was appointed as the Minister so called experts said that I dismissed doctors from schools. Now these people say again that doctors are still dismissed. Where is the logic? Resource officers cannot fulfill doctor’s functions. All doctors are registered by a contract. The reason is that standard of functions exist. What criteria should the doctor satisfy in order to be employed at schools.  We are cooperating on these issues with insurance agencies. They already entered in 5 schools and are refurbishing medical aid stations. School children will use this service free of charge. Doctors will stay at schools and in parallel standard will be prepared. False information was spread that librarians were dismissed. We are going to supply libraries with books from September. Librarian, organizer and head of office documentation worked in some small schools. We asked to fulfill these functions one person and he/she will receive more salary. I repeat that I will not approve false posts and 8-8 deputies.

It means that they struggle with you. Everyday many accuses are said towards you. Head of Educators and Scientists Free Trade Union, Manana Gur chumalidze said,you interfered in their activities.

I don’t think they struggle with me. This problem maybe exists everywhere – in all countries. The group exists that thinks it should have an influence on society. Clever people live in Georgia and they know you is right and who is unjust. So called experts say that MES holds Satan rituals. The argument is that I don’t round the school marks as rounding is the Satan’s job. Some people want to claim that white is black. This is their problem. It was said that I asked the principals to pay salaries to resource officers. This is false. MES will pay wages to them. After creating the electronic base it turned out that MES paid vouchers to 2,600 school children that were registered falsely. It is false also that resource officers wages amounts to 800 GEL. In reality their salary amounts to 400 Gel.

Is this fair that resource officers receive more salary than teachers?

Resource officers’ salary is more than teachers’ salaries only with 20 Gel. Teachers work 4-5 hours a day, resource officers – 10-12 hours.

I understand, but teachers’ and resource officers’ functions should be considered.

I agree. But resource officers’ duties are very responsible as well. They work twice more. Besides, they have no insurance and other privileges but teachers have. I want to increase teachers’ salaries and I will do that. As you teachers’ certification voluntary exams will be held soon. Certified teachers will receive additional salaries and they will work as mentor teachers  that includes additional 160Gel.

I want to underline that MES does not interfere in the activities of professional unions. I met with Ms. Manana Gurchumalidze many times. She was invited in almost all commissions that were created at MES. I offer her constructive relations. But no one will be able to humiliate teachers’ rights. Budget of this unions that are filed from the school transfers are very large. Law exists that should be followed by everyone. People are free in their choice. In this case I mean salaries. Teachers can transfer their salaries independently. But if someone requests the school to transfer salaries permanently two simple demands should be satisfied according to law. One  - teachers’ written agreement and the second – signed agreement between schools and unions. If teachers’ wages are transferred at any account without their agreement, this is named the crime in21st century. Several months ago I called all unions to solve this issue. But they didn’t. Unfortunately 6 principals transferred money. It is not pleasure but General Inspection is there, it checks the documents and then these documents will be sent to Prosecutor’s Office. These principals will express claims by all means. In the scope of Alumni club, public officials transferred money to their schools. 1mln Gel was transferred in different schools. This was endowment of officials, parents and etc. Some schools are being refurbished with these transfers. Some gave prizes. One school principal transferred money from alumni club to the professional union. The court will discuss the issue.75,000 teachers work in Georgia, but unions say there are 300,000 or 120,000 teachers.

I will protect teachers’ rights.

According to one of the claims, you ordered to put off icons in the class rooms. . .

This is very interesting question. When I worked in MCLA, false information was spread that I prohibited praying to the prisoners. Now the second round began. Commission is created at MES and it solves problems together with patriarchate. Many good projects are implemented together with patriarchate. I do not want to continue this theme.

Did you talk with principals on this theme?

No, but teachers ethics’ code will be launched from September. This code prohibits any kind of religious of political agitation, regardless religious schools. This is acceptable for patriarchate. If someone cannot understand they can find the word “Propaganda” in the dictionary. The problem was that Manana Gurchumalidze sold books at the meetings with the teachers.

One more innovation is school branding. It was sad that students of  ten star  school will not pass school diploma exams. Don’t you think the successful students of less stars will be oppressed.

This process is called “Ranzhing” abroad. We used more spread and well-known term. This institution creates healthy competition. According to public opinion all good schools are located in the center of the city. Believe that much more god schools are in peripheries. School branding will give the parents information about schools. The school with ten stars will hold exams independently. We will hold minimal competency level exam. We trust that school. This doesn’t mean that students of ten star schools do not pass exams.

As I know problems arose in replacing physical fitness lessons with sports classes.  Schools have no stadiums.

Physical fitness classes were Soviet remains. There was written to jump four times and etc. sports classes will make these lessons more interesting. The school will choose the type of sport and then we will refurbish the gym according to this choice. Inter leagues will be established at schools. the sports lessons will be divided into three parts: general physical training, concrete type of sport and games. We will retrain physical fitness teachers in August. Renovating gyms at schools will be finished in September.

5years old children will enter the schools from September. Psychologists evaluate this innovation negatively.

This is approbated practice in USA, England and other European countries. If any psychologist affirm that Georgian 5year old child is less developed than European, than I will think on this issue. if parent does not want to take 5 years old child at school, she/he will not take. Creating of special programs is underway. Program adaptation is being held for the first graders. Practice of taking 5years old child to school existed before and t was not tragedy. Some 6 years old children know more and the school program is not interesting for them in the first form. This was great definitely big problem.

Understand. Mr. Minister. Why have you prohibited relations of principals and teachers with the journalists?

This is one more interesting accuse. We only asked only school principals to inform us when the journalists visit them in the beginning of the reform because many things were changing and to avoid misunderstandings. No instructions were made. Opposite, MES is interested in relations with the fourth governmental body  - media.